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moscow_watcherBtVS season 8 issue 4: summary, analysis and conspiracy theories about that pesky kiss of true love, Ethan Rayne's fate and DH's anti-Spike stance.
In a nutshell: the first arc looks like magnificent storyboards for Michael Bay's next movie. And - Bander, sir!
Summary:
Issue 4 starts with the flashback of the scene in Villains in which Willow kills Warren. Inexplicably Willow's hair is red in this scene, although it was black on TV. Obviously media change causes some weird color shifts, because Willow's eyes are absolutely blue right now.
Meanwhile Buffy talks with Dawn about Willow outside their Scottish castle; the shadows they cast suggest two suns in the sky. Is it AU? Dawn says that Willow is like a mom for her. (In the previous issue we were told that Buffy and the rest of the Scoobies hadn't had news from Willow for a long time. In seasons 5-7 Willow\Dawn interaction was minimal except the moments when Willow tried to kill her - first unintentionally, then intentionally. Just saying.)
Meanwhile Warren tortures Willow (we only see her eyes and hands in (quoting Joss in Chosen) "a rictus of revelatory pain". Warren channels his inner Darth Vader and tempts Willow with darkness. She refuses: her spirit is strong because she is helped by five mystical beings connected with her in some supernatural way.
Back at Slayer Central, girls, who are reopening the portal, say that they can send one or two persons maximum through it. Buffy chooses a slayerette named Satsu - beautiful Japanese girl with cool katana - as her back-up. Before entering the portal Buffy asks Satsu is she has a lipgloss, and notices that Satsu's lipgloss has cinnamon taste - like the one on her lips after the kiss of true love. (Heh. In penultimate panel on issue #2 we saw Satsu on the castle wall fighting zombies when the kiss of true love occured.)
Portal reopens, evil military types on the other side send a death ray through it. But turns out good guys had magically figured out that bad guys will send a ray. They have put a mirror in front of the portal so that reflected ray is sent back to destroy bay guys. Buffy with her scythe and Satsu with her katana enter the building of The New Initiative throught the portal. Two girls armed with one scythe and one katana defeat about a hundred men heavily armed with guns.
Xander locates their position: they're two miles south of Sunnydale.
Buffy finds Amy who does her magic thingie against the slayers. Somehow Willow's spirit transmits to Buffy her magic abilities and Buffy defeats Amy too. A spirit of Amy's mother makes a cameo appearance and says that she saw Amy's nightmares. Warren and Amy escape with generic "This isn't over, Slayer". Buffy rushes to Willow who is OK and smiling. "Problems?"
Buffy asks Willow to heal wounded and dying soldiers. She sees a door with a number "30" on it. "OK, Ethan", she says. "You got yourself get out of jail free card." But Buffy's late. General Voll kills Ethan Rayne and tries to kill Buffy. She slams him at the wall and discover *that* sign on his chest.
"Twilight is coming", general says. "For you, for all your monstrous spawn ... You've upset the balance, girl. Do you really think we were going to sit by and let you create a master race? ... You're not human. You've been to war with demons, with the First, but, believe me, you've picked the wrong side. 'cause God help us, if you win then you'll decide that the world still isn't the way you want it, and the demon in you will say just one thing: "SLAY". We're not waiting for that to happen. We will wipe you out. Not just monsters anymore. It's you against the world. You're at war with the human race."
"Oh", Buffy says. "...kay".
Analysis:
The conclusion of the first arc is exhilarating and sad at the same time. The ambition looks enormous. So far, nobody wrote a convincing "human race vs super-human race" story.
I suppose on a RL level the situation is unsolvable. What happens when the principle of equal opportunities stops working naturally, from within? The race of superhumans can't peacefully co-exist with the race of humans. Their very existence creates a huge inferiority complex in ordinary people. They can either live in isolation from each other or fight for survival and the humans can't win by definition. The situation is very Joss Whedon-worthy, because he, as nobody else, can write natural human reactions in supernatural situations.
The problems he tackles in The Long Way Home are epic and, so far, they had never been explored properly. The greatest sci-fi writers tried to create a model of co-habitation of humans and superhumans, but nobody was able to find a convincing formula. I suppose Joss had been planning to explore this issue in Firefly, with the character of River.
Could Joss pull off such compelling story in comics without compromises? The tragism of "human race vs super-human race" story has a very Jossian scope, that's for sure.
But...
The choices Joss made so far give me the impression that he won't dare to delve into the heart of the matter and will boil the season down to more traditional and superficial "Bad Initiative vs good slayers" story. Because he consistently eliminates any serious stuff (Ethan Rayne's death is just another proof that this story doesn't need adult characters) and basically serves teenage audience with teenage love agnst, funny quips and cool fights.
The very idea of fighting against evil humans without modern weapons sounds very artificial. Opposing a mirror to high-tech weaponry works OK as a trick but what if bad guys used a bomb instead a ray? Obviously we're not supposed to care about such trifles. Anyway, Willow will heal everybody with a wave of her hand.
There is nothing wrong with it. It's just a different genre. It's all very McGyver-ish, and it works great if we accept the fact that the story has the McGyver level of credibility - i.e. is flippant, light-minded fun where we suspend our disbelief and don't mind implausibilities and give-aways.
Like, Warren is torturing Willow, but she's OK because some magick-y superbeings help her, and, as soon as Buffy arrives, she heals herself instantly. And she can heal everybody else. But she can't restore Xander's eye. Obviously because he looks super-cool with his eye-patch.
The same with Amy: she's a super-witch, she can do almost anything but for some inexplicable reason she has spent a couple of years in Sunnydale crater unable to get out.
The same with supernatural props; portals were hardingers of apocalypses in TV show, but in comics they became just a handy means of transportation.
I see no room for adult characters and adult themes in this kind of story. It's very season one-ish so far. So I think that "human race vs super-human race" story will boil down to "good slayers vs evil Initiative" type of story. Soon we'll find out that The New Initiative is only claiming tо represent the human race and they're just a bunch of evil misogynists whom Scoobies will defeat with quips and jokes.
Commercially, it's a great project. The core audience need good cheesy fun; they couldn't accept dark seasons and now Joss fixes his mistakes and caters to his audience because he needs a successful project after a number of flops.
I wonder if Joss had ever pondered upon the idea to write a novel. Because I think that his current ideas are more suitable for a novel than for a comic. Is writing novels so un-prestigious in America? Or it's just the matter of money?
Conspiracy theories:
Theory #1. The Kiss of True Love, or Bander!
Buffy has been kissed by somebody who had Satsu's lipgloss on his\her lips.
It can't be Satsu herself since she was on the castle wall fighting zombies and shouting "kill the head isn't working!" in her walky-talky when the kiss of true love occurred.
It can't be Willow because she has just arrived.
It can't be other slayerettes because creating such a complex mislead, with the participation of one extra, for another extra is stupid waste of time and paper.
The answer is evident. It was Xander.
I think Joss is repeating himself. (I remember reading somewhere that people lose their ability to create anything original after 40. Just saying.)
I suppose Joss recycles his kiss trick from Our Mrs. Reynolds. In Firefly 1.06 Mal Reynolds, inaware about Inara's love for him, thinks that she has kissed his fake "wife" - a con woman whose kiss puts people to sleep. Since both Mal and Inara fell asleep, Mal assumed that Inara has also kissed "mrs.Reynolds'. But in fact Inara kissed unconscious Mal and got her poison from *his* lips.
The situation is easy to apply here: Satsu tried to seduce Xander at the same time as Amy was performing her spell on Buffy, so she has left some cinnamon lipgloss on his lips.
Xander-as-the-kisser explains why Willow, who, AFAIK, doesn't have telepathic abilities, knows there is a person who's in love with Buffy in the room. She has just arrived and she doesn't know anybody but Xander. And she knows that he loves Buffy since season 1.
It's as simple as that.
Theory #2: Ethan can't die, or clutching at straws.
Has anybody paid attention to weird shadows in Ethan's cell? The light from a rectangular door creates a triangular pattern on one wall, then - oval pattern on another wall. Is it hack-work or it means that the whole tableau is an illusion created by Ethan who is very much alive?
I asked many people including professional artists, could the forms of these shadows mean something. All of them told me that it may be the matter of composition, balancing the light and the dark on the panel. Still, I hope that Ethan isn't completely dead. It just doesn't make sense.
Theory #3: Dark Horse vs Spike, or old wounds
People who read letters column, may have noticed a message of a fan who calls himself Shawler. (S)he hates Spike with a vengeance and colorfully describes how he loathes him. "Spike raped Buffy of most of her humanity and all of her humility... Please don't have Angel or disgusting Spike show up in this series!"
Interestingly, it's the second anti-Spike letter DH publishes. One may assume that the letter is carefully chosen to represent DH official policy: forget about dark themes, season 8 is about cool guys and cute girls. (And a lot of cheese.)
But there is something more. Back in 1998 DH had a row with James Marsters who played Spike. According to James Marsters Question and Answer Database by Bookworm54 JM was very vocal about his displeasure.
(4-04 Starburst) I'm angry about the comic book. I wrote a story that was very clear - it was a twisted romance. They hired a writer and treated it as a Gothic gross-out tale, which wasn't what I wrote. It was a good story, people responded to it, I appreciated that. But if they had done it the way I wrote it, it would have been ten times better. Dark Horse was dishonest with me with how they brought me into the project and what they told me it was going to be. I feel now, unless I can have total control over every single stage of it, I don't have any trust at all. I thought, in all my naivety, that I would have more control if I stopped being an actor and started being a writer. Of course, I found out that is not true.
I can't remember any other occasion of James dissing anybody. He's the nicest guy, he always complimentary on everybody. If he's so harsh on DH in an official interview (!), it means their row was truly epic. Could the editors have a personal vendetta against Spike due to the kerkuffle with the actor who played him?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
To sum it up, the first 4 issues of BtVS s8 indicate that it's a solid commercial project. It's sad to think about the missed opportunities - but I'm trying to look forward to cheesy fun. The first arc looks like magnificent storyboards for Michael Bay's next movie and I don't mind good entertainment.
And, last but not least, I recommend to read great reviews by![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
stormwreath, aycheb and elisi,
http://stormwreath.livejournal.com/16910.html?#cutid1
http://aycheb.livejournal.com/52334.html#cutid1
http://elisi.livejournal.com/258408.html#cutid1
owenthurman's musing on Willow's and Amy's eye color as well as discussion of the issue 4 on Whedonesque
In a nutshell: the first arc looks like magnificent storyboards for Michael Bay's next movie. And - Bander, sir!
Summary:
Issue 4 starts with the flashback of the scene in Villains in which Willow kills Warren. Inexplicably Willow's hair is red in this scene, although it was black on TV. Obviously media change causes some weird color shifts, because Willow's eyes are absolutely blue right now.
Meanwhile Buffy talks with Dawn about Willow outside their Scottish castle; the shadows they cast suggest two suns in the sky. Is it AU? Dawn says that Willow is like a mom for her. (In the previous issue we were told that Buffy and the rest of the Scoobies hadn't had news from Willow for a long time. In seasons 5-7 Willow\Dawn interaction was minimal except the moments when Willow tried to kill her - first unintentionally, then intentionally. Just saying.)
Meanwhile Warren tortures Willow (we only see her eyes and hands in (quoting Joss in Chosen) "a rictus of revelatory pain". Warren channels his inner Darth Vader and tempts Willow with darkness. She refuses: her spirit is strong because she is helped by five mystical beings connected with her in some supernatural way.
Back at Slayer Central, girls, who are reopening the portal, say that they can send one or two persons maximum through it. Buffy chooses a slayerette named Satsu - beautiful Japanese girl with cool katana - as her back-up. Before entering the portal Buffy asks Satsu is she has a lipgloss, and notices that Satsu's lipgloss has cinnamon taste - like the one on her lips after the kiss of true love. (Heh. In penultimate panel on issue #2 we saw Satsu on the castle wall fighting zombies when the kiss of true love occured.)
Portal reopens, evil military types on the other side send a death ray through it. But turns out good guys had magically figured out that bad guys will send a ray. They have put a mirror in front of the portal so that reflected ray is sent back to destroy bay guys. Buffy with her scythe and Satsu with her katana enter the building of The New Initiative throught the portal. Two girls armed with one scythe and one katana defeat about a hundred men heavily armed with guns.
Xander locates their position: they're two miles south of Sunnydale.
Buffy finds Amy who does her magic thingie against the slayers. Somehow Willow's spirit transmits to Buffy her magic abilities and Buffy defeats Amy too. A spirit of Amy's mother makes a cameo appearance and says that she saw Amy's nightmares. Warren and Amy escape with generic "This isn't over, Slayer". Buffy rushes to Willow who is OK and smiling. "Problems?"
Buffy asks Willow to heal wounded and dying soldiers. She sees a door with a number "30" on it. "OK, Ethan", she says. "You got yourself get out of jail free card." But Buffy's late. General Voll kills Ethan Rayne and tries to kill Buffy. She slams him at the wall and discover *that* sign on his chest.
"Twilight is coming", general says. "For you, for all your monstrous spawn ... You've upset the balance, girl. Do you really think we were going to sit by and let you create a master race? ... You're not human. You've been to war with demons, with the First, but, believe me, you've picked the wrong side. 'cause God help us, if you win then you'll decide that the world still isn't the way you want it, and the demon in you will say just one thing: "SLAY". We're not waiting for that to happen. We will wipe you out. Not just monsters anymore. It's you against the world. You're at war with the human race."
"Oh", Buffy says. "...kay".
Analysis:
The conclusion of the first arc is exhilarating and sad at the same time. The ambition looks enormous. So far, nobody wrote a convincing "human race vs super-human race" story.
I suppose on a RL level the situation is unsolvable. What happens when the principle of equal opportunities stops working naturally, from within? The race of superhumans can't peacefully co-exist with the race of humans. Their very existence creates a huge inferiority complex in ordinary people. They can either live in isolation from each other or fight for survival and the humans can't win by definition. The situation is very Joss Whedon-worthy, because he, as nobody else, can write natural human reactions in supernatural situations.
The problems he tackles in The Long Way Home are epic and, so far, they had never been explored properly. The greatest sci-fi writers tried to create a model of co-habitation of humans and superhumans, but nobody was able to find a convincing formula. I suppose Joss had been planning to explore this issue in Firefly, with the character of River.
Could Joss pull off such compelling story in comics without compromises? The tragism of "human race vs super-human race" story has a very Jossian scope, that's for sure.
But...
The choices Joss made so far give me the impression that he won't dare to delve into the heart of the matter and will boil the season down to more traditional and superficial "Bad Initiative vs good slayers" story. Because he consistently eliminates any serious stuff (Ethan Rayne's death is just another proof that this story doesn't need adult characters) and basically serves teenage audience with teenage love agnst, funny quips and cool fights.
The very idea of fighting against evil humans without modern weapons sounds very artificial. Opposing a mirror to high-tech weaponry works OK as a trick but what if bad guys used a bomb instead a ray? Obviously we're not supposed to care about such trifles. Anyway, Willow will heal everybody with a wave of her hand.
There is nothing wrong with it. It's just a different genre. It's all very McGyver-ish, and it works great if we accept the fact that the story has the McGyver level of credibility - i.e. is flippant, light-minded fun where we suspend our disbelief and don't mind implausibilities and give-aways.
Like, Warren is torturing Willow, but she's OK because some magick-y superbeings help her, and, as soon as Buffy arrives, she heals herself instantly. And she can heal everybody else. But she can't restore Xander's eye. Obviously because he looks super-cool with his eye-patch.
The same with Amy: she's a super-witch, she can do almost anything but for some inexplicable reason she has spent a couple of years in Sunnydale crater unable to get out.
The same with supernatural props; portals were hardingers of apocalypses in TV show, but in comics they became just a handy means of transportation.
I see no room for adult characters and adult themes in this kind of story. It's very season one-ish so far. So I think that "human race vs super-human race" story will boil down to "good slayers vs evil Initiative" type of story. Soon we'll find out that The New Initiative is only claiming tо represent the human race and they're just a bunch of evil misogynists whom Scoobies will defeat with quips and jokes.
Commercially, it's a great project. The core audience need good cheesy fun; they couldn't accept dark seasons and now Joss fixes his mistakes and caters to his audience because he needs a successful project after a number of flops.
I wonder if Joss had ever pondered upon the idea to write a novel. Because I think that his current ideas are more suitable for a novel than for a comic. Is writing novels so un-prestigious in America? Or it's just the matter of money?
Conspiracy theories:
Theory #1. The Kiss of True Love, or Bander!
Buffy has been kissed by somebody who had Satsu's lipgloss on his\her lips.
It can't be Satsu herself since she was on the castle wall fighting zombies and shouting "kill the head isn't working!" in her walky-talky when the kiss of true love occurred.
It can't be Willow because she has just arrived.
It can't be other slayerettes because creating such a complex mislead, with the participation of one extra, for another extra is stupid waste of time and paper.
The answer is evident. It was Xander.
I think Joss is repeating himself. (I remember reading somewhere that people lose their ability to create anything original after 40. Just saying.)
I suppose Joss recycles his kiss trick from Our Mrs. Reynolds. In Firefly 1.06 Mal Reynolds, inaware about Inara's love for him, thinks that she has kissed his fake "wife" - a con woman whose kiss puts people to sleep. Since both Mal and Inara fell asleep, Mal assumed that Inara has also kissed "mrs.Reynolds'. But in fact Inara kissed unconscious Mal and got her poison from *his* lips.
The situation is easy to apply here: Satsu tried to seduce Xander at the same time as Amy was performing her spell on Buffy, so she has left some cinnamon lipgloss on his lips.
Xander-as-the-kisser explains why Willow, who, AFAIK, doesn't have telepathic abilities, knows there is a person who's in love with Buffy in the room. She has just arrived and she doesn't know anybody but Xander. And she knows that he loves Buffy since season 1.
It's as simple as that.
Theory #2: Ethan can't die, or clutching at straws.
Has anybody paid attention to weird shadows in Ethan's cell? The light from a rectangular door creates a triangular pattern on one wall, then - oval pattern on another wall. Is it hack-work or it means that the whole tableau is an illusion created by Ethan who is very much alive?
I asked many people including professional artists, could the forms of these shadows mean something. All of them told me that it may be the matter of composition, balancing the light and the dark on the panel. Still, I hope that Ethan isn't completely dead. It just doesn't make sense.
Theory #3: Dark Horse vs Spike, or old wounds
People who read letters column, may have noticed a message of a fan who calls himself Shawler. (S)he hates Spike with a vengeance and colorfully describes how he loathes him. "Spike raped Buffy of most of her humanity and all of her humility... Please don't have Angel or disgusting Spike show up in this series!"
Interestingly, it's the second anti-Spike letter DH publishes. One may assume that the letter is carefully chosen to represent DH official policy: forget about dark themes, season 8 is about cool guys and cute girls. (And a lot of cheese.)
But there is something more. Back in 1998 DH had a row with James Marsters who played Spike. According to James Marsters Question and Answer Database by Bookworm54 JM was very vocal about his displeasure.
(4-04 Starburst) I'm angry about the comic book. I wrote a story that was very clear - it was a twisted romance. They hired a writer and treated it as a Gothic gross-out tale, which wasn't what I wrote. It was a good story, people responded to it, I appreciated that. But if they had done it the way I wrote it, it would have been ten times better. Dark Horse was dishonest with me with how they brought me into the project and what they told me it was going to be. I feel now, unless I can have total control over every single stage of it, I don't have any trust at all. I thought, in all my naivety, that I would have more control if I stopped being an actor and started being a writer. Of course, I found out that is not true.
I can't remember any other occasion of James dissing anybody. He's the nicest guy, he always complimentary on everybody. If he's so harsh on DH in an official interview (!), it means their row was truly epic. Could the editors have a personal vendetta against Spike due to the kerkuffle with the actor who played him?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
To sum it up, the first 4 issues of BtVS s8 indicate that it's a solid commercial project. It's sad to think about the missed opportunities - but I'm trying to look forward to cheesy fun. The first arc looks like magnificent storyboards for Michael Bay's next movie and I don't mind good entertainment.
And, last but not least, I recommend to read great reviews by
stormwreath, aycheb and elisi,http://stormwreath.livejournal.com/16910.html?#cutid1
http://aycheb.livejournal.com/52334.html#cutid1
http://elisi.livejournal.com/258408.html#cutid1
owenthurman's musing on Willow's and Amy's eye color as well as discussion of the issue 4 on Whedonesque ![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-09 07:00 pm (UTC)All issues seem adult-y to me, especially the last one, it was quite serious with less jokes and filled more with actions. Bander was only hinted at in #2, which we still don't know if it's true or just Buffy feeling horny and having only Xander as male around.
Anyway, I liked what I read especially the Buffy, Xander and three slayers (Leah, Satsu and Rowena) parts. The Giles parts were interesting, especially his thoughts in #2. I admit the whole Willow arc disappointed me a little. I still wish Dawn will get normal-sized. I wish Ethan wasn't killed. But other than that, it was all cool and didn't give me the S1 feel at all. It was early S7 that gave me the S1 feel (perhaps that's why it was the best part of S7) this one gives me a S4 feel instead.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-09 07:49 pm (UTC)I don't think he has something against adult characters. I think he got burned when he tried to introduce adult issues in later seasons. I love later seasons but I see that many people disliked his vision.
When I was talking about comics being not particularly adult, I meant the overall mood. The "kiss of true love" is straight from a fairy tale. Scoobies' adventures feel cartoonish because everything is achieved extremely easily. Warren's tortures don't leave a trave on Willow's face. Buffy and Satsu defeat hundred of heavily armed commandos with bare hands. Soldiers are dying but Willow can heal them all.
Overall, it just sounds very fanfic-y.
Bander was only hinted at in #2, which we still don't know if it's true or just Buffy feeling horny and having only Xander as male around.
As you may remember I predicted Bander when I saw the first Xander sketch for s 8, so to be consistent I'll go on with my theory :)
this one gives me a S4 feel instead
Oh, yes. Thematically it's very season 4.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-09 07:51 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-09 08:09 pm (UTC)One word: Chosen.
I don't think everything is easily achieved, Buffy would have been able to save Ethan if it was. That panel was very dark and scary, Buffy's expression broke me, I think it's the adult message of not everyone gets a meaningful ending, people can just be killed with no reason. Ethan had some info and wanted Buffy to save him, but she was too late. Even though I hated that Ethan died, I loved that Buffy wasn't able to save everybody.
The kiss of true love seems more mature than Puppet!Angel :)
Besides, it's the first episode, everything gets fine and dandy, just look at all the season premiers. I'm happy with it, just disappointed with everything that's Willow.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-09 10:07 pm (UTC)One word: Chosen.
In Chosen Joss killed off two regulars and some slayerettes. The Core Four survived but their victory had bitter taste.
I don't think everything is easily achieved, Buffy would have been able to save Ethan if it was.
I think she'd been able to save him if he was cute young girl (or boy). *sigh* Yes, I'm bitter.
The kiss of true love seems more mature than Puppet!Angel :)
I think Puppet!Angel was intended as a spoof of his heroic persona. The kiss of true love is supposed to be earnest and romantic.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 08:34 am (UTC)I think she'd been able to save him if he was cute young girl (or boy). *sigh* Yes, I'm bitter.
The kiss of true love seems more mature than Puppet!Angel :)
I think Puppet!Angel was intended as a spoof of his heroic persona. The kiss of true love is supposed to be earnest and romantic.
Isn't this rather a case of assuming the worst and then blaming Joss for your assumptions?
While many of the fans seemed to take the kiss of true love and who might bestow it extremely seriously the comic sidestepped the romantic angst to make it more an issue of who was prepared to admit to that love in public. And if it really is Satsu or one of her lip gloss sharing companions then the story becomes a thematically very interesting one about hero worship and celebrity. Buffy's moved on from being the girl everyone underestimated to the woman the whole world knows about.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 11:38 am (UTC)I don't blame Joss for anything. I'm sorry if it sounds like blaming - it wasn't the intention. I think Joss is doing a purely commercial project to satisfy core comics audience. And if we, fans of TV show, want to enjoy the season 8 we should suspend our disbelief and dismiss the retcons - "it's just a comic". Personally, I'm trying to tune myself in to good cheesy fun in the mold of season 1. I see a lot of bitterness on my f-list but I'm trying to stay positive, and I think the best way to do it is to lower the expectations and treat Season 8 as Joss' surviving in the drought season. It works OK this way.
While many of the fans seemed to take the kiss of true love and who might bestow it extremely seriously the comic sidestepped the romantic angst to make it more an issue of who was prepared to admit to that love in public.
I think the comic didn't sidestep romantic agnst. I think the kiss is played for serious and we'll be returning to this plot point many times until, finally, 5 years and 50 issues later we'll find out that it was Xander.
And if it really is Satsu or one of her lip gloss sharing companions then the story becomes a thematically very interesting one about hero worship and celebrity. Buffy's moved on from being the girl everyone underestimated to the woman the whole world knows about.
So, it's like Buffy Vs Dracula inside out? I agree - it would be interesting to see celebrity!Buffy.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 09:39 am (UTC)What I meant the Scoobies were able to kill the ubervamps easier than they kill a regular vampire while it took Buffy, with handy superpowers, two episodes to kill one. As for the deaths, Spike was brought back on Angel. This bringing back thing is ruining the story if you ask me, can't anyone just stay dead?
I think she'd been able to save him if he was cute young girl (or boy). *sigh* Yes, I'm bitter.
I'm still weirded out by this idea of adults getting killed that you and the members of FuzzyShark have. When the show ended, only Giles was the character who's years are beyond 40, and he appeared in two issues with something interesting going on. I bet he'll have a very interesting role later.
Even though I want Ethan around mostly for good scenes between him and Giles and nothing else, I rather loved how he was killed, it was thrilling and not cartoonish one bit.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 12:09 pm (UTC)While I can fanwank vamps and ubervamps as metaphors, it's very hard to apply this principle to non-mystical characters.
As for the deaths, Spike was brought back on Angel. This bringing back thing is ruining the story if you ask me, can't anyone just stay dead?
But then BtVS would have ended in Prophecy Girl...
I'm still weirded out by this idea of adults getting killed that you and the members of FuzzyShark have. When the show ended, only Giles was the character who's years are beyond 40, and he appeared in two issues with something interesting going on. I bet he'll have a very interesting role later.
I hope so. But I still don't see any prominent role for him in this type of show.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 12:36 pm (UTC)That first resurrection is kinda natural as many were brought to life because of CPR. I'm okay with Buffy being brought back because that in a whole was the biggest arc in S6. I mean bringing Spike back (which I'm grateful for 'cause I love the vamp) and then bringing Warren back and on AtS they'll probably bring Wesley back, and death lost its meaning.
I hope so. But I still don't see any prominent role for him in this type of show.
Perhaps his role will be like in S6 and S7, and perhaps it'll be bigger than that. But I'm sure Giles will have something big and interesting going for him, that bit with him in #3 was interesting.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 02:04 pm (UTC)*sigh* Pity that ASH decided to limit his presence in later seasons, which, for me, are the most interesting. I understand his family commitments and I don't blame him - but I wish he was there during the second part of season 6.
I agree that Giles' negotiations with a demon looked intriguing and ambivalent. I'm just afraid that his arc will be small and spread thinly on 50-plus issues with one panel in every second issue.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 02:28 pm (UTC)I thought Xander won't even get mentioned, (seeing as he barely was there in S7 -> don't count those times where he stood in the corner with one stupid line) and Giles will have a veeeery small role.
I'm glad to be proven wrong about Xander, and hopefully I'll be proven wrong about Giles.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 03:20 pm (UTC)I've been sure that Xander will be featured prominently in season 8 since I've seen the first sketches. Because after Spike has gone, Xander became the only ship-worthy male on the show.
And, interestingly, I feel that in season 7 Xander's presence is much bigger than in seasons 4-5. I vaguely remember a very old discussion on Cross and Stake spoiler board: somebody counted the number of lines for each character and proved that Xander had the second biggest role in s7 after Buffy herself. Willow had got the 3rd place, Spike - the 4th.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-10 05:36 pm (UTC)So other than standing in the corner and saying stupid jokes, I didn't have any hope for a good role to Xander in S8. Now I'm honestly happy, shocked and impressed. I didn't know Joss actually cared for the character anymore.
I have high hopes for a good Giles arc, but when will we be able to see it? I don't know. Xander's arc will start next year, Giles' will probably be the year after.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-13 11:24 am (UTC)'Smile Time' is one of the darkest, most disturbing and deeply layered episodes of TV ever! It is *also* very, very funny. In a word: genius.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-13 12:28 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-06-13 12:48 pm (UTC)that doesn't mean that things should be mature to be good.
Oh that we can agree on! Heck my husband loves Buffy the Movie for that very reason. :)